On the sclerosis
When the EU was formed there were roughly as many countries as there are areas of legitimate public policy. So, give each country someone in charge of one of those areas. Call them Commissioners, the things they control Directorates General and when lumped together The Commission can be like a Civil Service layer as most member states have.
This is, and was, grand.
However there are now 28 - soon to be 27 - member states. There are simply not 27, let alone 28, different areas of public policy. But each country still wants a Commissioner, and each much run a Directorate General.
So each issue that in most member states would be looked at by a single department fall within the competency (I use the term loosely) of several Directorates General. Each of these wants to be in charge, of course; and all the people doing the work have career structures predicated on them being the ones who made the difference.
So everything takes multiples of the time and resource it should do, even before you start looking at governance for decisions and so on.
There have been moves to streamline things, but very timid ones. They need to look much more radically at governance than they ever have, really.
And - entirely separate - the whole taking Parliament to Strasbourg every Friday (at enormous cost) because otherwise the French would sulk? Really?
Again, I'm a dyed in the wool Remainer. Despite all the above it's clearly in our economic interest to stay in the EU, at least in my view. Many continental "old Europe" countries have a much more emotional attachment to the EU than we have: for all the privations we suffered in the world wars we were never invaded; some argue that's one reason for it, others that our national character is simply towards the pragmatic end of the scale. Of course the more Eastern, new-accession countries have a different view again.
Posted By: Old Man on March 23rd 2019 at 12:51:15
Message Thread
- Best arguments for Leave (Betting) - Old Man, Mar 23, 10:42:18
- Fairer access to UK markets for developing nations (Betting) - CWC, Mar 23, 15:42:34
- well... (Betting) - Ralf Scrampton, Mar 23, 22:15:37
- Ah fucksticks, wish I'd known that 3 years ago (Betting) - CWC, Mar 24, 11:26:32
- well... (Betting) - Ralf Scrampton, Mar 23, 22:15:37
- Oh hang on. I've found one (Betting) - Steve in Holland, Mar 23, 14:00:13
- I would like to see the Brexit discussion simplified to the point of (Betting) - Steve in Holland, Mar 23, 13:55:31
- Precisely why a referendum was a catastrophically bad idea. You want to know what effect (Betting) - Higher Wrather, Mar 23, 14:08:43
- it needs them to be able to think beyond the immediate and obvious (Betting) - Ralf Scrampton, Mar 23, 14:17:18
- Or how being part of a federal europe (Betting) - paulg, Mar 23, 15:00:15
- Paulg, why would that even play a part in the discussion right now? It is not currently (Betting) - Steve in Holland, Mar 23, 15:10:24
- as the law stands there would have to be a referendum for a change that big (Betting) - Ralf Scrampton, Mar 23, 17:53:56
- Paulg, why would that even play a part in the discussion right now? It is not currently (Betting) - Steve in Holland, Mar 23, 15:10:24
- Simpler example.. (Betting) - Steve in Holland, Mar 23, 14:48:13
- Or how being part of a federal europe (Betting) - paulg, Mar 23, 15:00:15
- it needs them to be able to think beyond the immediate and obvious (Betting) - Ralf Scrampton, Mar 23, 14:17:18
- Precisely why a referendum was a catastrophically bad idea. You want to know what effect (Betting) - Higher Wrather, Mar 23, 14:08:43
- There are other reasons. There's the EU (basically Germany and France) treatment of Greece (Betting) - Higher Wrather, Mar 23, 13:15:19
- That's the David Owen argument (Betting) - biffbro, Mar 23, 17:42:45
- We are/were one of those stronger nations (Betting) - CWC, Mar 23, 16:12:29
- I see that as a subset of the federal europe/ sovereignty argument (n/m) (Betting) - paulg, Mar 23, 13:36:05
- a disaster like EUFOR you mean? (Betting) - Tombs, Mar 23, 13:35:01
- I imagine it becoming like the UN - well meant but pointless. But I know that I don't know (Betting) - Higher Wrather, Mar 23, 13:57:34
- I don't think it would (Betting) - Tombs, Mar 23, 15:12:00
- I imagine it becoming like the UN - well meant but pointless. But I know that I don't know (Betting) - Higher Wrather, Mar 23, 13:57:34
- don't believe all you've been told about an EU army (Betting) - Ralf Scrampton, Mar 23, 13:33:17
- Coming in here with your reasoned debate! Outrageous behaviour 👍 (n/m) (Betting) - Worthing Yellow, Mar 23, 12:55:01
- Good well reasoned post (Betting) - Tressells Broadbrush, Mar 23, 12:38:58
- PS re tax havens I absolutely share your suspicions (n/m) (Betting) - Old Man, Mar 23, 12:59:08
- On the sclerosis (Betting) - Old Man, Mar 23, 12:51:15
- If anything (Betting) - paulg, Mar 23, 12:19:21
- I agree re federalism (Betting) - Old Man, Mar 23, 12:34:21
- To some extent (Betting) - paulg, Mar 23, 13:09:35
- although that argument against the Euro is a bit overblown imo (Betting) - Ralf Scrampton, Mar 23, 12:50:13
- I don't think it's overblown (Betting) - paulg, Mar 23, 13:02:26
- what's that claim based on? (Betting) - Ralf Scrampton, Mar 23, 13:24:12
- Greece is now one of the best economic performers in the Eurozone according to the IMF (n/m) (Betting) - Steve in Holland, Mar 23, 13:04:56
- Any growth in Greece is a bubble (Betting) - Mecagoenti, Mar 23, 14:27:55
- BT is part owned by Deutsche Telekom. Associated British Ports is foreign-owned. BP is (Betting) - Steve in Holland, Mar 23, 15:29:08
- No, it's not different in many respects (Betting) - Mecagoenti, Mar 23, 16:02:49
- BT is part owned by Deutsche Telekom. Associated British Ports is foreign-owned. BP is (Betting) - Steve in Holland, Mar 23, 15:29:08
- Any growth in Greece is a bubble (Betting) - Mecagoenti, Mar 23, 14:27:55
- Yeah this is fair (Betting) - Old Man, Mar 23, 12:54:23
- I don't think it's overblown (Betting) - paulg, Mar 23, 13:02:26
- I agree re federalism (Betting) - Old Man, Mar 23, 12:34:21
- There is the left wing argument as well (Betting) - Mecagoenti, Mar 23, 11:07:22
- The former is absolutely true (Betting) - Old Man, Mar 23, 11:19:28
- Completely agree, that EU policies have definitely (Betting) - Mecagoenti, Mar 23, 11:41:49
- Second para made no sense, try again (Betting) - Old Man, Mar 23, 11:22:02
- The former is absolutely true (Betting) - Old Man, Mar 23, 11:19:28
- If I was a leaver (Betting) - CauldRon, Mar 23, 10:54:29
- I am a leaver and you are 100% correct on this. The level of incompetence (Betting) - Basingstoke_Canary, Mar 23, 13:42:54
- Fairer access to UK markets for developing nations (Betting) - CWC, Mar 23, 15:42:34
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