But leave could never have a concrete plan because they will not necessarily

be the ones doing any renegotiation if we leave and obviously nobody knows how that negotiation will pan out. So if the pre-requisite for any referendum is a concrete plan then you can never have one.

Posted By: Jim on June 20th 2016 at 11:12:50

Message Thread

Still not sure which way to vote. Leave or Remain. So much nonsense and lies on both sides (General Chat) - Pit, Jun 20, 10:26:28
- FAO: undecideds - a nice brief quick fire question round to each side here (General Chat) - essexcanaryOTBC, Jun 20, 11:41:56
- all our best friends in the world strongly want us to remain (General Chat) - mr carra, Jun 20, 11:35:22
  - Balls to the best friends. What about Lenwade Dinosaur Park? (General Chat) - I Am Hoot, Jun 20, 11:55:45
    - Petits Animal Adventure Park (n/m) (General Chat) - essexcanaryOTBC, Jun 20, 12:23:00
- all our b (n/m) (General Chat) - mr carra, Jun 20, 11:33:57
- Remember: "an idea isn't responsible for the people who believes (General Chat) - dennis moore, Jun 20, 11:28:56
  - *believe* (n/m) (General Chat) - dennis moore, Jun 20, 11:29:41
- If you're Labour through and through you wouldn't vote remain (General Chat) - harry boulders, Jun 20, 10:57:56
  - You think we would become like Spain/Greece? We have our own currency btw (General Chat) - essexcanaryOTBC, Jun 20, 11:40:25
    - If we didn't, there would have been a U introduced in PIGS a few years back. It was that (General Chat) - Steve in Holland, Jun 20, 12:14:54
    - So it was good the EU bailed out Greece, in effect making everybody else pay for (General Chat) - harry boulders, Jun 20, 11:48:01
      - nah, they're paying for the crap banks that lent to them... (n/m) (General Chat) - Ralf Scrampton, Jun 20, 12:10:41
        
        Banks/Bankers (excessive risk taking) broke the economy, not the EU, not migrants etc (General Chat) - essexcanaryOTBC, Jun 20, 12:20:22
        
        "Farage Is A Millionaire Banker" (General Chat) - essexcanaryOTBC, Jun 20, 12:24:16
  - and yet the Greek people would overwhelmingly vote to remain (General Chat) - mr carra, Jun 20, 11:32:44
    - that's not true - at least not for Spain (General Chat) - Mecagoenti, Jun 20, 11:39:16
      - it is always true that extremists on both sides want to leave and moderates to stay (General Chat) - mr carra, Jun 20, 11:42:17
        
        the left wing in Spain are not extremists (General Chat) - Mecagoenti, Jun 20, 11:45:33
        
        from an economic viewpoint the EU is more favourable to the working classes than the Torie (General Chat) - Ralf Scrampton, Jun 20, 12:00:17
        
        absolutely; the fact that the debate has been comprehensively taken over (General Chat) - Mecagoenti, Jun 20, 12:04:13
        
        Johnson + co talk about regaining "control" (General Chat) - essexcanaryOTBC, Jun 20, 12:21:22
        
        i've just had the following tweeted into my timeline which you might find interesting (General Chat) - Ralf Scrampton, Jun 20, 12:15:21
        
        thanks for that, is an interesting piece (General Chat) - Mecagoenti, Jun 20, 12:22:54
        
        Which is why most extremists want us to leave (General Chat) - essexcanaryOTBC, Jun 20, 11:44:00
  - EU =/= Euro (General Chat) - CWC, Jun 20, 11:08:25
    - EXACTLY! (n/m) (General Chat) - essexcanaryOTBC, Jun 20, 11:40:59
    - don't think they have deep structural problems (General Chat) - Mecagoenti, Jun 20, 11:22:20
      - They do/did have big problems with large scale tax avoidance. (General Chat) - APB, Jun 20, 13:20:19
        
        fair point (General Chat) - Mecagoenti, Jun 20, 13:57:50
    - Not to mention deep structural problems in them actually paying tax (n/m) (General Chat) - Steve in Holland, Jun 20, 11:18:35
- This is good but long. Worth it though. (General Chat) - APB, Jun 20, 10:54:39
  - Chairs. will read and think (n/m) (General Chat) - Pit, Jun 20, 11:30:30
    - Watch. It's a video (n/m) (General Chat) - Steve in Holland, Jun 20, 11:36:07
      - is there a non-video, written version? (n/m) (General Chat) - Ralf Scrampton, Jun 20, 11:43:41
        
        Not that I've seen (n/m) (General Chat) - Steve in Holland, Jun 20, 12:50:42
  - Shared that. Cheers (n/m) (General Chat) - Steve in Holland, Jun 20, 11:26:53
  - the government get to borrow money cheaper now, based on those long term benefits (General Chat) - Ralf Scrampton, Jun 20, 10:57:29
    - That's as maybe but I wasn't thinking of government (General Chat) - APB, Jun 20, 10:59:19
      - ok, the government spend money on and for normal people (General Chat) - Ralf Scrampton, Jun 20, 11:08:06
    - debt repayment? interest is what i meant (General Chat) - Ralf Scrampton, Jun 20, 10:58:25
- The UK has the best of both worlds at the moment................... (General Chat) - Larry Hagman, Jun 20, 10:51:55
  - Yes really makes no sense to leave other than an emotional sense of bravado (n/m) (General Chat) - Steve in Holland, Jun 20, 10:53:58
    - Cutting nose off to spite face? (General Chat) - essexcanaryOTBC, Jun 20, 11:44:54
    - there's a fair argument in terms of democratic accountability (General Chat) - CWC, Jun 20, 11:10:09
      - But what remain have managed to successfully bury is that even those (General Chat) - Jim, Jun 20, 11:15:39
        
        link please (n/m) (General Chat) - Ralf Scrampton, Jun 20, 11:50:21
- Vote for the reasons to vote for, not the personalities. Vote remain. (n/m) (General Chat) - Steve in Holland, Jun 20, 10:45:50
  - Exactly this! Trying to vote based on personalities in this vote is futile, (General Chat) - I Am Hoot, Jun 20, 10:56:13
    - Its uncertainty causing this. nothing do do with in or out. (General Chat) - Pit, Jun 20, 11:10:36
      - Leave = Uncertainty, so yes you're right that it's uncertainty that's casuing this (General Chat) - Ralf Scrampton, Jun 20, 11:56:04
      - No, it is all to do with 'confidence' in how the UK would be outside of the EU (n/m) (General Chat) - Larry Hagman, Jun 20, 11:17:11
        
        no. (n/m) (General Chat) - Pit, Jun 20, 11:23:45
        
        stock markets are a gamble based upon 'confidence' of what will happen in the future (n/m) (General Chat) - Larry Hagman, Jun 20, 11:44:15
        
        You're saying the same thing. Confidence = considerable degree of certainty. (n/m) (General Chat) - Steve in Holland, Jun 20, 12:10:49
      - Sure, I know what you're saying and you're right. (General Chat) - I Am Hoot, Jun 20, 11:16:39
    - We had a recession,that was worse than the impact being predicted if we leave..... (General Chat) - yellowman, Jun 20, 11:09:20
    - Lol the pound and stock market are up and down regardless (n/m) (General Chat) - harry boulders, Jun 20, 11:03:29
      - One thing i think it completely wrong is that the financial institutions are allowed to (General Chat) - Jim, Jun 20, 11:16:57
        
        Everyone knows the likely result is remain (General Chat) - SCC 28, Jun 20, 11:38:35
        
        I get the feeling that it has changed. Seriously. Have been investigating the cases for (General Chat) - Steve in Holland, Jun 20, 12:09:30
    - Punctuation. (General Chat) - I Am Hoot, Jun 20, 11:00:24
- There really is not a lot of certainties with a leave vote, despite what both sides claim (General Chat) - South_West_Canary, Jun 20, 10:43:31
  - Not to mention all of the expert economic bodies too! (n/m) (General Chat) - essexcanaryOTBC, Jun 20, 12:25:22
    - Cor yeah....forgot about them..... (General Chat) - yellowman, Jun 20, 13:00:09
  - several of them aren't being entirely honest .... (n/m) (General Chat) - paulg, Jun 20, 11:35:08
  - Because they see an end to the gravy train..... (General Chat) - yellowman, Jun 20, 10:50:34
    - Thats an odd one for me. Kinnock was a working class champion and now has his snout (General Chat) - Pit, Jun 20, 11:08:29
      - power corrupts (General Chat) - Mecagoenti, Jun 20, 11:32:11
      - Politics int ut?...... (General Chat) - yellowman, Jun 20, 11:13:02
        
        Robin Cook. One of the few politicians I ever had any respect for. (n/m) (General Chat) - Pit, Jun 20, 11:23:10
        
        Actually yes and John smith..... (General Chat) - yellowman, Jun 20, 11:25:45
        
        Agree. 3 good eggs. (n/m) (General Chat) - Pit, Jun 20, 11:30:50
    - You have a low opinion of ALL of them leaders? (n/m) (General Chat) - South_West_Canary, Jun 20, 10:52:25
      - Yep...... (General Chat) - yellowman, Jun 20, 10:56:09
        
        I think you do a lot of them leaders an injustice (n/m) (General Chat) - South_West_Canary, Jun 20, 10:57:28
        
        Ok... (General Chat) - yellowman, Jun 20, 11:03:13
        
        Corbyn isn't all misty eyed over Europe, but thinks it's the best option (General Chat) - South_West_Canary, Jun 20, 11:10:23
        
        Ok (n/m) (General Chat) - yellowman, Jun 20, 11:14:12
- When is the result announced? (General Chat) - Chris Peacock, Jun 20, 10:41:06
  - agreed, sick to fucking death of it now (General Chat) - Tombs, Jun 20, 10:50:49
- I have been firmly leave throughout the process but am having a last minute wobble (General Chat) - Jim, Jun 20, 10:33:00
  - The timing of anything is bad if you don't have a plan (n/m) (General Chat) - Steve in Holland, Jun 20, 10:47:04
    - But leave could never have a concrete plan because they will not necessarily (General Chat) - Jim, Jun 20, 11:12:50
  - I have been stay in but will now vote to leave, If I was selfish I would have to vote stay (General Chat) - lovely old job, Jun 20, 10:36:06
    - I've gone from stay to leave too. Heart over head decision for once (n/m) (General Chat) - Hulk Rules, Jun 20, 10:41:31
- You forgot our very own Ed Balls and Delia on remain side (n/m) (General Chat) - loz, Jun 20, 10:27:47

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