Alf Garnett was presented as "the common man" in Til Death Do Us Part, though ...

... and so it could be argued that the viewer was supposed to sympathise with him to an extent. I never did, and have never found Alf Garnett offensive, but yes - I see the problem with the Alf Garnett stuff that some people wouldn't get the irony and identify Garnett as a role model/hero/whatever.

Alf Garnett's more complex, too, because if you don't like him, then his character is a very damning indictment of the English working classes, stereotyping them as racist and ignorant, which is also problematic.

With Hamburger, though, he's very recognisably "a pathetic stand-up comedian" and doesn't demand identification or sympathy in that same way, so I find it a lot less problematic. And far more funny. But there you go.

Posted By: Ottosson Foxtrot on March 20th 2007 at 15:35:07

Message Thread

If everyone was the same there would be no comedy (General Chat) - Tomblander, Mar 20, 15:07:51
- To me, the best comedy should subvert (General Chat) - BerlinCanary, Mar 20, 17:30:48
- Comedy is a very selective taste (General Chat) - Brandonio, Mar 20, 15:17:56
  - i am the latter (n/m) (General Chat) - SCC 28, Mar 20, 15:50:58
  - Case in point (General Chat) - yarmyyarmy, Mar 20, 15:24:08
    - oops... (General Chat) - yarmyyarmy, Mar 20, 15:25:26
      - i can't see how gervais loves david (General Chat) - SCC 28, Mar 20, 15:51:40
        
        You do realise some of the comedy characters you've slagged off on here today are (General Chat) - Brandonio, Mar 20, 15:58:12
        
        hey some of my stuff's actually my own! (n/m) (General Chat) - SCC 28, Mar 20, 16:06:00
        
        what's he like in the flesh then? (General Chat) - Tricky Hawes, Mar 20, 16:00:29
        
        That's exactly right, TH ... (n/m) (General Chat) - Ottosson Foxtrot, Mar 20, 16:02:04
        
        ouch! (n/m) (General Chat) - SCC 28, Mar 20, 16:05:20
        
        You are very meek and mild-mannered though ... (General Chat) - Ottosson Foxtrot, Mar 20, 16:10:41
        
        nah (General Chat) - SCC 28, Mar 20, 16:11:58
  - Which is the essence of the debate (General Chat) - Tomblander, Mar 20, 15:23:13
    - I fear you and OG have missed the point on that particular gag (apologies if not ... (General Chat) - Ottosson Foxtrot, Mar 20, 15:28:55
      - John Thomson used to do a PC Bernard Manning stand up routine (General Chat) - yarmyyarmy, Mar 20, 15:32:16
        
        I'm not saying the mother law is tight but (General Chat) - pants, Mar 20, 16:35:31
      - I see your point. Can you see mine? (General Chat) - Tomblander, Mar 20, 15:31:48
        
        Yes Alf Garnett was hilarious though... (General Chat) - Brandonio, Mar 20, 15:35:23
        
        Agreeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee eed (n/m) (General Chat) - Tomblander, Mar 20, 15:48:11
        
        Alf Garnett was presented as "the common man" in Til Death Do Us Part, though ... (General Chat) - Ottosson Foxtrot, Mar 20, 15:35:07
        
        I once saw an interview with Warren Mitchell... (General Chat) - Brandonio, Mar 20, 15:49:12
        
        Horses for course (General Chat) - Tomblander, Mar 20, 15:47:48
        
        I like Stephen Fry a lot too, as it happens. (General Chat) - Ottosson Foxtrot, Mar 20, 15:48:44
        
        I was a bit gutted to miss that (n/m) (General Chat) - Brandonio, Mar 20, 15:50:29
        
        it's being repeated on BBC 2, though the 2nd (of 3) may have been last night (n/m) (General Chat) - blindasabat, Mar 20, 15:56:08
        
        I don't have a telly at the moment (n/m) (General Chat) - Brandonio, Mar 20, 15:58:49
        
        go to cash converters you could probably pick a small portable up for about a tenner... (n/m) (General Chat) - blindasabat, Mar 20, 16:02:37
        
        Well, I'll give Hamburger a go and see what happens (General Chat) - Tomblander, Mar 20, 15:50:14
  - *In Curb Your Enthusiasm (n/m) (General Chat) - Brandonio, Mar 20, 15:19:56
- Neil Hamburger, to me, is so clearly a parody that I don't see too much grey area ... (General Chat) - Ottosson Foxtrot, Mar 20, 15:14:51
  - Can't comment on Mr Hamburger having not experienced his show (General Chat) - Tomblander, Mar 20, 15:17:11
  - Ironic or not, Al Murray is proper wank (n/m) (General Chat) - yarmyyarmy, Mar 20, 15:16:43
    - I'm not actually a big fan either - I just agreed with Brandonio's take on him below. (General Chat) - Ottosson Foxtrot, Mar 20, 15:19:16
      - My favs are Bill Hicks, Dave Gorman, Richard Pryor and Paul Merton (General Chat) - Brandonio, Mar 20, 15:27:02
        
        Newman and Baddiel (General Chat) - yarmyyarmy, Mar 20, 15:43:25
        
        I still find Newman very very funny. (General Chat) - Arizona Bay, Mar 20, 15:45:22
        
        I think he's a holier-than-thou lecturing hypocrite (General Chat) - yarmyyarmy, Mar 20, 15:51:42
        
        He *is* a holier-than-thou lecturing hyprocrite, but very very funny, I reckon. (General Chat) - Arizona Bay, Mar 20, 15:56:25
        
        a wanker? (n/m) (General Chat) - blindasabat, Mar 20, 15:44:05
        
        oh and don't bother reading Baddiel's debut novel "is that what love is" (or similar) (General Chat) - blindasabat, Mar 20, 15:46:08
        
        Whatever Love Means was his 2nd novel. His debut novel was Time For Bed (General Chat) - Arizona Bay, Mar 20, 15:51:34
        
        i sit corrected :-) (n/m) (General Chat) - blindasabat, Mar 20, 15:57:14
        
        I like Lee & Herring and Simon Munnery an awful lot, too. (n/m) (General Chat) - Ottosson Foxtrot, Mar 20, 15:29:25
        
        Lee and Herring were very good. (General Chat) - Arizona Bay, Mar 20, 15:33:24
  - al murray is shit (n/m) (General Chat) - SCC 28, Mar 20, 15:15:44

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