True story
Had a cab ride back from the airport last week. On the way, my heart sunk as the driver began talking on the subject of Brexit.
He started slowly with the basics. He didn’t like the EU as he didn’t like freedom of movement. Nothing against the people coming here, but there was no work for English lads (his words).
He then denounced politicians in general for the time it was taking. Brexit means Brexit. We just need to plough on and get out. Should have just left without any negotiation at all, the week after the referendum. Nothing bad would happen. Stuff about backlogs at ports and food and medicine shortages was Project Fear. Couple of days, all sorted. The EU need us more than we need them.
Then we moved on. He was an ex painter and decorator who couldn’t get work. Too many Poles and Romanians. He liked the Poles - good honest blokes. He hates Romanians. Sneaky thieves all of em.
At this point I had to speak up. Surely a whole nation can’t be dismissed so easily. Did he think that everyone in the logistics industry and every trade expert was part of some conspiracy to pretend that crashing out might bring about profound problems. Had he thought about the evidence that we needed immigrant labour to keep a number of sectors going, or that on balance immigrants created more jobs than they took, and paid more in tax than they take. That the problems of English lads who can’t find work might be more rooted in technological change hollowing out decent jobs, and a cash starved education system failing to prepare people. Or that a lot of companies who depend on frictionless trade seem very likely to leave taking a load of jobs with them.
At this point he twigged that what he thought was a safe audience for his rant was anything but, and went on the offensive. He just wanted things to go back to how it was. Not so many foreigners hanging around town, nicking our jobs and taking out houses.
I appreciate that this is just one person. And in a democracy, everyone gets a say and what he thinks is just as important as anyone else. But he’s ignorant and bigoted. Most of the conversations I’ve had with Brexit voters seem to involved similar themes. Having immigrants in the country is bad (it isn’t). Absolutely nothing bad will happen if we leave, deal or no (it will). I just want it go back to like it was (totally impossible, as technological progress is changing everything).
And otherwise, basically not a single argument about the E.U. and why the state were in is bad and a direct consequence of being a member.
I’ve now given up trying to persuade people. Leavers are too invested. The ones I’ve spoken too simply will not be persuaded and have an aversion to reason and evidence. We need to just push on and suffer the consequences. Then as country falls further behind and as living standards for ordinary folk fall, we can think about rejoining with a genuine consensus that this is good in X years.
I try not to post on Brexit anymore. Other than this of course.
Posted By: Under soil heating on March 15th 2019 at 09:25:04
Message Thread
- good morning to all the racists on this board (General Chat) - ghostof barry butler, Mar 15, 07:47:59
- Sadly I think there was a "bloody foreigners" factor in some of the leave vote. (n/m) (General Chat) - MORDENCANARY, Mar 15, 13:56:55
- Silly. (General Chat) - tim berry, Mar 15, 11:11:20
- literally no one says that all leave voters are racists (General Chat) - Worzel Scrimmage, Mar 15, 15:12:36
- You should work in TV news (General Chat) - Ben, Mar 15, 09:30:42
- We should have a people's vote (General Chat) - Chris Peacock, Mar 15, 09:43:41
- True story (General Chat) - Under soil heating, Mar 15, 09:25:04
- Exactly, Brexit became a nostalgia vote for many people. We all, me included, think things (General Chat) - megson, Mar 15, 10:36:36
- Excellent post USH. Agree with everything except (General Chat) - Dunney, Mar 15, 10:13:37
- Yes let's just forget about any pretense at democracy. Fuck that. (n/m) (General Chat) - protheroe fitzgibbon, Mar 15, 10:24:11
- Ah yes. The 'seeing if people have changed their minds is undemocratic' argument. (n/m) (General Chat) - Dunney, Mar 15, 10:46:21
- Sometimes it's better to enact the result of the vote (General Chat) - Basingstoke_Canary_J, Mar 15, 11:29:56
- Well (General Chat) - Dunney, Mar 15, 13:23:38
- Tells you that everyone's bored and knackered! (n/m) (General Chat) - paulg, Mar 15, 17:01:52
- *applauds* the fact that none of the brexiters replied to this truth tells you everyhting (General Chat) - Worzel Scrimmage, Mar 15, 16:08:46
- Not if people have decided they no longer want to enact that decision, as it is not (General Chat) - megson, Mar 15, 12:13:20
- We are a remarkably tolerant country... (General Chat) - Pablo, Mar 15, 12:25:35
- In terms of racial tolerance (General Chat) - paulg, Mar 15, 13:08:03
- We are a remarkably tolerant country... (General Chat) - Pablo, Mar 15, 12:25:35
- Well (General Chat) - Dunney, Mar 15, 13:23:38
- Sometimes it's better to enact the result of the vote (General Chat) - Basingstoke_Canary_J, Mar 15, 11:29:56
- Ah yes. The 'seeing if people have changed their minds is undemocratic' argument. (n/m) (General Chat) - Dunney, Mar 15, 10:46:21
- Yes let's just forget about any pretense at democracy. Fuck that. (n/m) (General Chat) - protheroe fitzgibbon, Mar 15, 10:24:11
- It's a straightforward point which you are deliberately misinterpreting. (General Chat) - norway, Mar 15, 08:32:01
- I know several racists who voted to stay (General Chat) - paulg, Mar 15, 09:45:37
- that's the problem - complexity and nuance never got a look-in in this fiasco, from the (General Chat) - Higher Wrather, Mar 15, 10:12:42
- I cldn't agree more (General Chat) - paulg, Mar 15, 10:27:14
- And are indeed illegal in Germany, for example. (n/m) (General Chat) - APB, Mar 15, 10:58:44
- and yet work very well in Switzerland (n/m) (General Chat) - Pablo, Mar 15, 12:30:32
- And are indeed illegal in Germany, for example. (n/m) (General Chat) - APB, Mar 15, 10:58:44
- I cldn't agree more (General Chat) - paulg, Mar 15, 10:27:14
- that's the problem - complexity and nuance never got a look-in in this fiasco, from the (General Chat) - Higher Wrather, Mar 15, 10:12:42
- I think we know already he will say anything for a bit of attention (n/m) (General Chat) - Basingstoke_Canary_J, Mar 15, 08:50:21
- I know several racists who voted to stay (General Chat) - paulg, Mar 15, 09:45:37
- Good morning then (n/m) (General Chat) - Basingstoke_Canary_J, Mar 15, 08:21:06
- Your logic concludes......... (General Chat) - Highlander, Mar 15, 08:09:01
- Erm, not sure how you define logic gobb and Highlander (General Chat) - Yellalee, Mar 15, 08:30:36
- Think we need a Venn diagram (n/m) (General Chat) - Steve in Holland, Mar 15, 09:51:00
- Did you know that John Venn built a bowling machine? (General Chat) - paulg, Mar 15, 10:03:20
- Think we need a Venn diagram (n/m) (General Chat) - Steve in Holland, Mar 15, 09:51:00
- hmmm.... 65% of the electorate didn't vote for Brexit. (n/m) (General Chat) - Pixelman, Mar 15, 08:20:44
- Young people under 25 tend to be remained..... (General Chat) - MORDENCANARY, Mar 15, 13:59:50
- hey not my logic (General Chat) - ghostof barry butler, Mar 15, 08:12:10
- Great quote, only thing missing were the quotation marks. (n/m) (General Chat) - Basingstoke_Canary_J, Mar 15, 08:57:15
- Well it was nobody else's logic... (n/m) (General Chat) - Yellalee, Mar 15, 08:43:13
- Erm, not sure how you define logic gobb and Highlander (General Chat) - Yellalee, Mar 15, 08:30:36
- Yawn (n/m) (General Chat) - yarmouthyellow, Mar 15, 08:00:06
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