Its ridiculous to simply say its all due to "underinvestment" when

we have population growth of a level that is not sustainable. And I appreciate that growth is not all due to immigration.

You could always say "we haven't built enough schools" or "we haven't built enough houses" but there comes a point where you cannot physically do it when you are allowing (at least) 330,000 people plus a year to move to the UK. What if due to issues in the Eurozone next year its 500,000 or the year after that its 1,000,000? Do you just keep building schools, houses and doctors surgeries until we've built on virtually every bit of land available? We are already building thousands of houses on greenfield sites contrary to the wishes of local communities because we cannot get anywhere near meeting current housing need. That's leaving aside the social/community aspects flowing from the levels of immigration we've seen in recent years which are also relevant. Change of the sort of pace we have seen brings insecurities and they are perfectly understandable.

I'm not demonizing immigrants here. Immigration brings benefits to our society of course, but your insistence that anyone who holds a different opinion to you on this subject is mistaken is typical of the kind of arrogance that has been evident in a lot of the reaction to the referendum vote and also that in part led to the result.

Posted By: Jim on July 5th 2016 at 12:46:56

Message Thread

Quick, before people come on and tell us off for being political, anyone going to the Nor (n/m) (General Chat) - Bravo win or die, Jul 5, 07:23:46
- What is the protest against? Democracy? (n/m) (General Chat) - lurd, Jul 5, 07:31:59
  - 41 years those cunts were moaning about not getting the result they wanted (General Chat) - Ralf Scrampton, Jul 5, 07:46:07
    - Perhaps again Ralf but this time with a little more feeling (n/m) (General Chat) - Dandy Highburyman, Jul 5, 08:28:49
    - Breezy (n/m) (General Chat) - lurd, Jul 5, 07:56:48
      - It's the way I tell 'em... (n/m) (General Chat) - Ralf Scrampton, Jul 5, 08:20:15
  - its a we want democracy protest (General Chat) - Disshater, Jul 5, 07:35:51
    - LOL absolutely, its oinly democracy if the result aligns with our point of view! (n/m) (General Chat) - Kirrie, Jul 5, 09:36:55
      - No, that's such a 'clickbaity' style response that is clearly misses the point. (General Chat) - I Am Hoot, Jul 5, 09:47:43
        
        There wouldn't be any remain demonstartaions if the result had gone their way... (General Chat) - Kirrie, Jul 5, 11:31:03
        
        Demonstrations even..... (n/m) (General Chat) - Kirrie, Jul 5, 11:31:57
        
        There definitely needs to be greater control over campaign material. I was shocked to find (General Chat) - Jim, Jul 5, 09:51:05
        
        Part of the problem is that there are different aspects of political literature (General Chat) - watfordcanary, Jul 5, 13:03:42
        
        Exactly, and this is the biggest gripe. Not the result. (n/m) (General Chat) - I Am Hoot, Jul 5, 09:53:58
      - It wasn't an exercise in democracy, it was a total cop out by a (General Chat) - CB41, Jul 5, 09:38:51
        
        This! Such a complex situation should never have been distilled down to a yes or no vote. (n/m) (General Chat) - I Am Hoot, Jul 5, 09:48:45
        
        Not quite true, the Tories were elected with this as a centrel point of their manifesto... (General Chat) - Kirrie, Jul 5, 09:42:48
        
        they were elected with economic and political stability as their centre points (General Chat) - Ralf Scrampton, Jul 5, 10:23:14
        
        Exactly, but it was still a copout. They should have had a manifesto (General Chat) - CB41, Jul 5, 09:49:35
        
        You may be right, but its a tradition in many democracies that matters.... (General Chat) - Kirrie, Jul 5, 09:58:54
        
        If that is their manifesto, and they are elected on it, they should be able to (n/m) (General Chat) - CB41, Jul 5, 10:02:19
        
        The Scottish independence result proved at the time, that although a majority of Scottish (General Chat) - Kirrie, Jul 5, 11:34:41
        
        Then they voted for the wrong government (n/m) (General Chat) - CB41, Jul 5, 11:40:13
    - I can cope when Norwich lose but if we lost through cheating I'd be cross. (General Chat) - Bravo win or die, Jul 5, 07:56:54
      - Fair enough but it's a false narrative that there were lots of lies (General Chat) - Jim, Jul 5, 08:57:30
        
        I agree, pleanty of lies on both sides - Osborne's emergency budget for instance! (n/m) (General Chat) - Kirrie, Jul 5, 09:31:19
        
        not needed as no Art 50 served... (General Chat) - CWC, Jul 5, 10:11:38
        
        Well, it did serve to rid uus of a whole load of c**ts at the top. Trouble is, (General Chat) - CB41, Jul 5, 10:17:32
        
        trouble is... (General Chat) - CWC, Jul 5, 10:20:53
        
        I know, there are no words. (n/m) (General Chat) - CB41, Jul 5, 10:24:23
        
        That may still happen, who knows. Probably won't be Osborne's though (n/m) (General Chat) - CB41, Jul 5, 09:37:31
        
        It may do, but Osborne told a bare faced lie that it would happen.... (General Chat) - Kirrie, Jul 5, 09:41:01
        
        we didn't serve notice to leave though, did we? (General Chat) - CWC, Jul 5, 10:14:51
        
        Ffs, HE'S A POLITICIAN. THEY ALL LIE. EVERYONE KNOWS THAT (n/m) (General Chat) - CB41, Jul 5, 09:42:20
        
        I know, I'm only making the point that both sides told Porkies. (n/m) (General Chat) - Kirrie, Jul 5, 09:44:04
        
        But why? That's like saying the sky is blue. Everyone knows (n/m) (General Chat) - CB41, Jul 5, 09:46:59
        
        Really; some in the country, on here, even in this thread.... (General Chat) - Kirrie, Jul 5, 09:52:33
        
        but they really weren't as bad as each other (General Chat) - Ralf Scrampton, Jul 5, 10:28:42
        
        Thats your opinion which I repsect, but I just don't agree with. (n/m) (General Chat) - Kirrie, Jul 5, 11:24:44
        
        Because the protests (like the OP) are happening because of the so called lies. (n/m) (General Chat) - lurd, Jul 5, 09:51:51
        
        I think the protests are happening because of the closeness of the (General Chat) - CB41, Jul 5, 10:01:09
        
        Unfortunately these protests will provoke a reaction soon,and it won't be pretty. (n/m) (General Chat) - protheroe fitzgibbon, Jul 5, 10:25:00
        
        Indeed. Uncork the bottle and watch it fizz (n/m) (General Chat) - CB41, Jul 5, 10:26:40
        
        No they are not. they are happening because a lot of (General Chat) - Jim, Jul 5, 09:55:47
        
        no, no, no. You have been lied to for years by The Daily Heil, The Scum, The Daily Express (General Chat) - Ralf Scrampton, Jul 5, 10:35:11
        
        I can see perfectly clearly thanks and I am fully aware of the level of (General Chat) - Jim, Jul 5, 10:45:56
        
        but their serious concerns are mistaken (General Chat) - Ralf Scrampton, Jul 5, 10:53:27
        
        In your opinion. In many other people's opinion they are not. (n/m) (General Chat) - Jim, Jul 5, 11:32:17
        
        the causes are mistaken - that is not a matter of opinion (n/m) (General Chat) - Ralf Scrampton, Jul 5, 11:42:19
        
        With respect it very clearly is. (n/m) (General Chat) - Jim, Jul 5, 12:02:34
        
        with ever decreasing respect, no it isn't. (General Chat) - Ralf Scrampton, Jul 5, 12:11:20
        
        Its ridiculous to simply say its all due to "underinvestment" when (General Chat) - Jim, Jul 5, 12:46:56
        
        there's only about 10% of land built on though Jim, we're really not running short of room (General Chat) - Ralf Scrampton, Jul 5, 13:34:57
        
        and tellingly, the highest leave voting areas were those with (General Chat) - CB41, Jul 5, 13:50:26
        
        Agree with most of that (n/m) (General Chat) - lurd, Jul 5, 10:32:54
        
        ....or misrepresentations, call them what you want, I'm fed up with this total myth that.. (General Chat) - Kirrie, Jul 5, 09:33:52
        
        Both sides told lies but Leave's lies happened end to be their 3 key 'pledges' (General Chat) - I Am Hoot, Jul 5, 09:43:30
        
        No this is wrong (General Chat) - Knitted Jesus, Jul 5, 09:25:57
        
        The ?350m is money we don't control. Rebates & EU financed (General Chat) - dennis moore, Jul 5, 09:46:14
        
        AND you tell me exactly how I must spend the ?150 you give me back! (n/m) (General Chat) - Kirrie, Jul 5, 09:53:32
        
        And Osborne was told the same about the ?4300 per household figure (General Chat) - Jim, Jul 5, 09:30:02
        
        Can I ask you what benefits you think that leaving will bring? (General Chat) - Linighans wake, Jul 5, 09:34:18
        
        Yes.i think we will end up either in the EEA or a similar agreed model with (General Chat) - Jim, Jul 5, 09:47:42
        
        Sorry Jim, no offence, but that is an incredibly naive view. Hope you (General Chat) - CB41, Jul 5, 09:54:20
        
        Well lets wait and see (which is really what everyone should be doing). The (General Chat) - Jim, Jul 5, 10:03:49
        
        The problem is, any form of freedom of movement will be seen as (General Chat) - CB41, Jul 5, 10:13:54
        
        We should get on with it but say we will only serve Article 50 simultaneously with (General Chat) - Jim, Jul 5, 10:19:34
        
        Maybe we can do a deal that means we can send our unemployable, (General Chat) - CB41, Jul 5, 10:23:26
        
        "And it was a lie to say that leaving the EU would result in a loss of workers rights" - (General Chat) - CB41, Jul 5, 09:32:48
        
        Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong (n/m) (General Chat) - CB41, Jul 5, 09:25:21
        
        A lot of Remain voters seem to think the Leave side were extremely gullible and believed (General Chat) - lurd, Jul 5, 09:25:15
        
        Lots of leave voters came out afterwards and... (General Chat) - loz, Jul 5, 09:27:58
        
        No they didn't. Probably a few posts on facebook seized upon by (General Chat) - Jim, Jul 5, 09:32:13
        
        Yes they did Jim take your blinkers off (n/m) (General Chat) - loz, Jul 5, 09:43:57
        
        How many people voted remain due to thinking we (General Chat) - Jim, Jul 5, 09:53:09
        
        I think thats because people have come out in public (General Chat) - Knitted Jesus, Jul 5, 09:26:56
        
        That's bizarre. It's like admitting you are really, really gullible. Why would (General Chat) - CB41, Jul 5, 09:30:13
        
        Anyway, it's happened now and the best thing we can do is leave (General Chat) - CB41, Jul 5, 09:41:09
        
        Strongly disagree (n/m) (General Chat) - loz, Jul 5, 09:19:21
        
        Disagree. (n/m) (General Chat) - avenging canary, Jul 5, 09:12:45
      - This is the big point. The lies that only the next day were admitted to have been made up. (General Chat) - I Am Hoot, Jul 5, 08:16:21
        
        What I find depressing is that anyone with half a brain cell actually (General Chat) - CB41, Jul 5, 09:24:50
        
        yeah I know. Some people seem to have lost the ability to have critical thought these days (n/m) (General Chat) - I Am Hoot, Jul 5, 09:53:04
- (Arrrgh!) Norwich Stays protest outside City Hall, 7pm Thursday? (n/m) (General Chat) - Bravo win or die, Jul 5, 07:24:49
  - I'm hoping to go along, yes. (n/m) (General Chat) - bird table, Jul 5, 09:40:00
  - Ah, another anti democracy protest. That will help. (n/m) (General Chat) - Jim, Jul 5, 08:53:07
  - No... (General Chat) - Dandy Highburyman, Jul 5, 08:25:51

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