I think that's a bit harsh on Gazza

At his best he was more than just a runner - could find space, pick a pass, do the unexpected, as well as beat players with the ball at his feet.

Not saying he was as good as Mata though. And he wasn't at his best for long.

More generally, seems to me we have been really short of this kind of player. Suspect it;'s something to do with physical nature of English footie, or something. Players who could have been that may have got bullied out of it, perhaps.

Posted By: Tricky Hawes on October 11th 2013 at 09:58:24

Message Thread

Seems to be a suggestion that Wilshere will be left out tonight (Other Football) - Tricky Hawes, Oct 11, 09:43:41
- Won't Milner tuck in with Lampard and Gerrard? (Other Football) - norway, Oct 11, 10:11:14
  - No doubt (Other Football) - Tricky Hawes, Oct 11, 10:13:08
    - ooney will be the central fulcrum - closest to a number 10 really (n/m) (Other Football) - norway, Oct 11, 10:14:03
- Am I alone in genuinely not caring.. (Other Football) - loz, Oct 11, 10:01:26
  - I feel a little more enthused now that it looks like some of the biggest c**ts in the team (Other Football) - Maillot Jaune, Oct 11, 11:12:31
    - Would you fight and die for Norwich? (Other Football) - Tricky Hawes, Oct 11, 11:14:31
      - Well its about national pride I guess...supporting england football team being somewhere (Other Football) - Maillot Jaune, Oct 11, 11:20:55
        
        Bet your family and friends will be glad to hear that. (n/m) (Other Football) - CB41, Oct 11, 11:25:11
        
        If they can' run fast enough...well thats natural selection innit. Fuck 'em (n/m) (Other Football) - Maillot Jaune, Oct 11, 11:29:02
        
        not sure it's a pride thing (Other Football) - SCC 28, Oct 11, 11:24:25
        
        My son is Enlish/polish and born in switzerland...which identity does he get? (Other Football) - Maillot Jaune, Oct 11, 11:27:43
        
        should be where he grew up (n/m) (Other Football) - SCC 28, Oct 11, 11:29:12
        
        well he got lucky on the football front then I guess...according to your logic (Other Football) - Maillot Jaune, Oct 11, 11:32:07
    - Depends on the circumstances doesn't it? (Other Football) - duke of york, Oct 11, 11:14:18
      - He is around (Other Football) - CB41, Oct 11, 11:26:11
  - being a football fan means loving your club and country (Other Football) - SCC 28, Oct 11, 10:11:39
    - I love my club .. (Other Football) - loz, Oct 11, 11:53:22
      - Two slightly different statements, to be fair (Other Football) - norway, Oct 11, 11:57:37
        
        nit picking (n/m) (Other Football) - sotoncanary, Oct 11, 12:45:27
        
        See what you mean but not really... (Other Football) - loz, Oct 11, 12:07:33
        
        Agreed - I think most people do choose club over country (Other Football) - norway, Oct 11, 12:13:32
        
        I honestly won't... (Other Football) - loz, Oct 11, 12:23:01
        
        boom (n/m) (Other Football) - duke of york, Oct 11, 12:03:16
        
        vmt (n/m) (Other Football) - SCC 28, Oct 11, 12:00:18
    - yeah, that'll help SCC. (n/m) (Other Football) - Tricky Hawes, Oct 11, 10:12:01
      - He is Trollosaurus Rex (Other Football) - Old Git, Oct 11, 10:14:52
        
        and odious too (n/m) (Other Football) - CB41, Oct 11, 10:17:39
        
        don't forget deep seated (Other Football) - SCC 28, Oct 11, 10:19:44
        
        Wrong though. I'd have said spectacularly shallow. (n/m) (Other Football) - CB41, Oct 11, 10:24:58
        
        quite the opposite (n/m) (Other Football) - SCC 28, Oct 11, 10:27:08
        
        lol... bit harsh! (n/m) (Other Football) - norway, Oct 11, 10:18:21
        
        only if it's not true ;-) (n/m) (Other Football) - CB41, Oct 11, 10:21:01
        
        Ok, I think I'm missing something here (Other Football) - norway, Oct 11, 10:22:49
        
        Best left there probably (n/m) (Other Football) - CB41, Oct 11, 10:23:53
        
        ahem bantosaurus! (n/m) (Other Football) - SCC 28, Oct 11, 10:15:28
  - You're certainly not alone in asserting it (Other Football) - Tricky Hawes, Oct 11, 10:06:48
    - When we get to the Quarter finals next year everyone will be on board (Other Football) - strap_on sally, Oct 11, 10:20:39
      - Ha. Problem is, that's when we lose (Other Football) - Tricky Hawes, Oct 11, 10:37:10
  - Probably in the minority (Other Football) - duke of york, Oct 11, 10:02:19
    - Nope really couldn't care less... (Other Football) - loz, Oct 11, 10:05:18
      - what do the players have to do with it? (Other Football) - SCC 28, Oct 11, 10:13:18
        
        For me its about supporting your team/country through thick and thin (Other Football) - strap_on sally, Oct 11, 10:25:56
        
        Trouble is, since the 5-0 thrashing of Germany, it's been mainly rough (n/m) (Other Football) - CB41, Oct 11, 10:39:21
        
        Although, of course, in that game (Other Football) - duke of york, Oct 11, 10:53:20
        
        Our time will come (n/m) (Other Football) - strap_on sally, Oct 11, 10:47:36
        
        yep will be just like andy murray (n/m) (Other Football) - SCC 28, Oct 11, 10:52:57
        
        It does a bit, duntit? (Other Football) - Old Git, Oct 11, 10:16:29
        
        but you still wanted us to be successful (Other Football) - SCC 28, Oct 11, 10:19:18
        
        I guess it colours one's feelings though (Other Football) - Old Git, Oct 11, 10:26:51
        
        well yeah, but surely it didn't stop you supporting them and hoping, against all (Other Football) - CB41, Oct 11, 10:19:02
        
        Are you OK? (Other Football) - duke of york, Oct 11, 10:20:41
        
        Change of image (n/m) (Other Football) - CB41, Oct 11, 10:22:34
        
        It's never too late (n/m) (Other Football) - norway, Oct 11, 10:23:29
        
        Indeed, time's running out (n/m) (Other Football) - CB41, Oct 11, 10:25:41
        
        exactly (n/m) (Other Football) - SCC 28, Oct 11, 10:20:02
- Ross Barkley is a number 10 for Everton (Other Football) - duke of york, Oct 11, 09:48:29
- Gazza yes (Other Football) - Old Git, Oct 11, 09:46:50
  - Yes, fair point re Scholes (Other Football) - Tricky Hawes, Oct 11, 09:50:40
    - He also retired from international football at about 29/30? (n/m) (Other Football) - duke of york, Oct 11, 09:51:42
- You could certainly blame him for leaving Wilshere out (Other Football) - duke of york, Oct 11, 09:44:52
  - Not really he is said to be unwell... (Other Football) - loz, Oct 11, 10:02:41
    - You care enough to know more than I do... (n/m) (Other Football) - duke of york, Oct 11, 10:03:05
      - ROLF (n/m) (Other Football) - SCC 28, Oct 11, 10:13:53
      - Well I read the papers yes (n/m) (Other Football) - loz, Oct 11, 10:05:53
        
        an article about england (Other Football) - SCC 28, Oct 11, 10:14:34
        
        Read about them in the papers, post about them on message boards (Other Football) - norway, Oct 11, 10:13:05
        
        But you are not a horse racing fan... (Other Football) - loz, Oct 11, 12:09:40
        
        ok, but I think the analogy is sound (Other Football) - norway, Oct 11, 12:14:40
  - but Wilshere has been pretty sh*t all season (Other Football) - mr carra, Oct 11, 10:02:32
  - Yeah, but Wilshere isn't that player really, even though we all wish he was (Other Football) - Tricky Hawes, Oct 11, 09:52:36
    - Barkley is more of a strong runner (Other Football) - duke of york, Oct 11, 09:55:21
      - I think that's a bit harsh on Gazza (Other Football) - Tricky Hawes, Oct 11, 09:58:24
        
        The rigid 4-4-2 system of english football really restricted the development of these (Other Football) - Maillot Jaune, Oct 11, 10:15:21
        
        Interesting (Other Football) - Tricky Hawes, Oct 11, 10:17:26
        
        Le Tissier could easily have been a withdrawn striker (Other Football) - norway, Oct 11, 10:20:09
        
        Point about 4-4-2 - as we used to play it - was that there was no role for a withdrawn (Other Football) - Tricky Hawes, Oct 11, 10:31:59
        
        Big man / little man (Other Football) - duke of york, Oct 11, 10:36:09
        
        Graham Taylor was one of the biggest step backwards in British Football (Other Football) - Maillot Jaune, Oct 11, 10:50:09
        
        It was such a shame Glenn Hoddle opened his mouth and got the sack (Other Football) - strap_on sally, Oct 11, 10:53:16
        
        I don't think the fundamental problem has been England managers (Other Football) - Tricky Hawes, Oct 11, 10:57:57
        
        Surely should be different now (Other Football) - duke of york, Oct 11, 11:01:06
        
        *quantity*, I meant. (n/m) (Other Football) - Tricky Hawes, Oct 11, 10:58:21
        
        I was wondering how much wasted talent there must be in the Inner cities (Other Football) - strap_on sally, Oct 11, 11:02:42
        
        Unfit and lazy (Other Football) - duke of york, Oct 11, 10:21:42
        
        Like ROI not picking Wessi for years... (Other Football) - duke of york, Oct 11, 10:00:56
        
        Glenn Hoddle (Other Football) - duke of york, Oct 11, 10:09:23
        
        Le Tissier another waste...around the same time as Gazza (n/m) (Other Football) - Maillot Jaune, Oct 11, 10:10:40
        
        Ian Crook (Other Football) - duke of york, Oct 11, 10:09:56

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